Are there any species you wish had shown up more, played a bigger part, or had been used differently? Here are some I keep thinking about.
Rabbits
You can count the number of times rabbits show up on one hand, they don't stick around very long, and play small roles. Yet they're always interesting, helpful, and have something worthwhile to say.
The weird thing is the series long running gag about many creatures mistaking hares for rabbits, which would greatly imply that rabbits are more common, or at least more well known. I can certainly see them among the moles, hedgehogs, dormice and voles as members of the supporting cast. Why Jacgues didn't do more with them I'll never understand.
Bats
Some might argue that they're too situational to appear often, but there are so many times a tale of Redwall takes us to a cave, tunnel or subterranean area there's ample opportunity for them to show up and help out. Heck, a lot of bats live outside of caves ya know. Heck, they even could've had one live in the abbey's bell tower.
What really interests me is how it was suggested that bats have their own culture in their dark worlds and how they weren't very tough, but still had some fight in them.
Wolves
I mean, COME ON!
Lizards
I know, they showed up often. But they were often random, weak, low level thugs who were easily dealt with and didn't play much of a role. The only ones worth talking about were the Monitors from Pearls of Lutra, and even then most of them went down like scaly chumps. To be fair, a lot of the lizards species that are common to the UK really aren't as tough/cool as some species, but when I think lizards in an adventure/fantasy story, I think of something fast, agile and ferocious.
At the very least I really wish he'd let use their tails a lot more and/or that regeneration thing.
Toads
In early books they were a problem...then they were just random, downright mindless thugs. My main concern is thinking they should've used their tongues to hit animals or used their hopping abilities to body slam/ram into/crush fools.
Giant Invertebrates
Mariel of Redwall had a giant lobster and scorpion. Mossflower, Lord Brocktree, and The Legend of Luke had giant crabs. And I have wonder about the stag beetle Cluny made his helmet from.
Come to think of it, I'm surprised Jacques NEVER had a run-in with a big spider or two while he was at it...
Sharks
Them showing up infrequently is awkward enough (though to be fair, them being overused would've been bad too), but Jacques just didn't seem to want to make good use of them. Mind you, I haven't read all the books they've appeared in, but the one from Triss felt more like a nuisance than an actual threat. Hell, Jacques made pike and eels show more common and even scarier!
What about guys? Any underused animals you wish Jacques had used more often or better ???
YESSSSS!
Wildcats needed to be used more. Riggu Felis and his catguards were, in my opinion, the most cunning. More cat armies!
I like Jacques' use of seals and sea lions. They're always friendly, show up at just the right moments, and unlike sharks, understand spoken language. The seals spinning the Greenshroud around in circles in The Rogue Crew made me laugh out loud.
Wolves, lizards, and giant invertebrates.
Wolves because: "I mean, COME ON!"
Lizards because: There was never a lizard that tried to take over Redwall; that would be cool because an enemy that isn't a mammal leading a siege or attack would be interesting, perhaps even thinking very differently than vermin. Perhaps every one of his soldiers would be intent on not only taking over Redwall, but eating the inhabitants as well. Frightening.
Giant invertebrates: They would probably show up in like a cave or something that they stumble upon and are inevitably eradicated.
I was always very interested in the bats, it would be been cool if they had a bigger role. I'm not sure wolves would've been a good idea, they sound too powerful (kind of like a wolverine from Rackety Tam). I think Brian Jacques could have done a lot with toads, lizards, and giant invertebrates. It would be awesome for a horde of them to attack Redwall.
I think at least one proper wolf villain would've been interesting. He included a wolverine which certainly isn't and wasn't a UK species (yes, I know we're told he comes from another land), so a wolf that did use to roam here would've been doable really!
As I've said quite a few times before, with nods to my name - definitely should've been more rabbits. It's just strange knowing how numerous they are that they don't crop up a bit more. Clearly Jacques wasn't a big fan?
Yeah, bats I'd agree. I don't see a big reason why there couldn't have been more bats - and even ones with a community.
I would have even at least once given mention to a deer maybe! I know they're too big for the Redwall universe... but it wouldn't have hurt, even if it was just 'they saw this great antlered beast from a distance', or so.
I dislike them, but I see that there could've been more invertebrates mentioned... imagine the characters coming face to face with a nasty great spider - yuck!
All of those really would have been cool to see more of, however what I think lots of people would have liked to see would be birds. granted you see a bird here, and he uses a bird of prey there but you never see and large groups of warrior birds. imagine how dangerous they would be, they could literally be the dominate species if they learned metal workings and made weapons and other such things. I can just imagine more from say, the Sparra.
Quote from: LT Sandpaw on February 03, 2015, 09:04:29 PM
All of those really would have been cool to see more of, however what I think lots of people would have liked to see would be birds. granted you see a bird here, and he uses a bird of prey there but you never see and large groups of warrior birds. imagine how dangerous they would be, they could literally be the dominate species if they learned metal workings and made weapons and other such things. I can just imagine more from say, the Sparra.
That's a really good point. It bothers me how Jacques only used the Sparrows in just 2 books and never again, not even the prequels. It's amazing how he threw out a steady supply of bird friends in favor of having the heroes somehow join up with a bird of prey. Not to mention how it would've been nice if he'd done more with other song birds (Robins, thrushes, and numerous others) or even water fowl.
Playing favorites, Brian ???
On a related note, anyone else wish there'd been more evil--or at least morally ambiguous--birds of prey?
The way that almost all birds seemed to become completely good is one of the strangest alignment changes in the series.
In the first book, Redwall, we have (besides the Sparra) Captain Snow. While he's a "good guy" in as much as that he's friends with several other protagonists, this alignment is a little shaky, given his propensity to eat mice and shrews. Mossflower famously features Argulor, as well as an unnamed owl at Bat Mountpit. While some (including myself) have made the case that Argulor wasn't exactly a villain, he isn't a protagonist either. At this point in the series, birds of prey seem to be aligned towards evil (or at least antagonistic).
...and then, from Mattimeo onwards, this radically changes. Sir Harry the Muse and Stryk Redkite both appear as invaluable allies for the protagonists. Mariel also features a good owl who saves the main characters' hides. Salamandastron and Martin the Warrior feature birds of prey that are aggressive and dangerous, but at the end of the books, they're all solid good guys. The Bellmaker also has an ally bird, although he leaves before the end of the book. Outcast, Skarlath... then Gerul and other good owls through Marlfox. I'm not going to continue; the point is pretty well made that birds of prey were all good.
So it's established this is a thing. The question is, why? It can't be their natural alignment; all of these rely on mice as a staple food. My best guess is that it has to do with the way they're viewed by the population at large. Most people think of birds of prey as noble animals. So, they are. Simple as that -- even though it seems to contradict their actual existence, where they continually feed on what the series has established are the good guys.
I think I preferred birds of prey as how they were portrayed in the first two books -- aggressive, a little mysterious, and extremely dangerous. It gave a little balance to the books, knowing that there was a creature around that could devour any of the main characters, and it required them to keep their wits about them. It doesn't help that some of the birds were used as deus ex machinas -- blatantly so in Mariel, where the heroes blunder into a trap and are only saved because an owl happened to be around.
On a side note, I liked your portrayal of an owl as a villain in your fanfiction about the bat, and hope that story is completed at some point.
BJ obviously based his books off of real life animals (well, his first one or two) so it isn't surprising to make Snow an antagonist.
I don't wish wolves had been used more. I think it's a good thing that wolves are mysterious-- wolves have been eradicated from the British Isles, after all, and they aren't exactly common in mainland Europe. If wolves were used more, they could easily have become boring and commonplace, and thus lost the sense of mystery.
Who agrees with me: The coneslingers didn't get enough pages in the book. Huh?
I agree, the Coneslingers weren't big enough characters. I barely remember them (from Triss, right?), and Brian Jacques should be either made them bigger characters, or just get rid of them and have the characters solve their problem on their own.
I think herons.
I often forget about Mokug the golden hamster in Triss. He was the only one of his species in the series.
Quote from: urthstripe on February 14, 2015, 03:51:26 PM
I think herons.
Me too. I love herons.
I also agree with lizards.
One wolf in the series would be awesome, the only wolf in the series is barely mentioned and even then, it is dead, "killed by Urgan Nagru" and that hardly does them justice
also, adders as main villains would be pretty cool, imagine an adder leading a force of lizards against Redwall
lastly, a hedgehog hero couldn't hurt
Quote from: CpnRake335 on February 19, 2015, 11:00:07 PM
lastly, a hedgehog hero couldn't hurt
This! There was never a mole who wielded the Sword of Martin either. I think it would definitely have been interesting to see a mole hero.
Also the Sparra, I wish they hadn't disappeared completely after Mattimeo!
Yes, I miss the Sparra. Hedgehogs and Moles I think could have done more, they aren't mentioned much in the series. Was a mole ever Abbot or Abbess? I know there was one hedgehog so far.
the sparra were killed off by Ironclaw's crows and Malkeris? archers in Mattemeo, its a pity they died out
and while there has been a hedgehog hero, they are never the main hero, same with moles
Did you know there was a beaver in the series that was only mentioned in one book, Redwall
Rabbits, mentioned in Martin the Warrior
and a golden hamster somewhere (forgot book name)
Quote from: CpnRake335 on February 21, 2015, 04:39:04 PM
the sparra were killed off by Ironclaw's crows and Malkeris? archers in Mattemeo, its a pity they died out
and while there has been a hedgehog hero, they are never the main hero, same with moles
Did you know there was a beaver in the series that was only mentioned in one book, Redwall
Rabbits, mentioned in Martin the Warrior
and a golden hamster somewhere (forgot book name)
It's Ironbeak.
I have to say that a mole hero would be cool. Arula was one, but it hardly counts.
Even though hares play a large part in every book, it's really just Buckler Kordyne who I see as a main hare protagonist.
Quote from: CpnRake335 on February 21, 2015, 04:39:04 PM
the sparra were killed off by Ironbeak's crows and Malkeris? archers in Mattemeo, its a pity they died out
and while there has been a hedgehog hero, they are never the main hero, same with moles
Did you know there was a beaver in the series that was only mentioned in one book, Redwall
Rabbits, mentioned in Martin the Warrior
and a golden hamster somewhere (forgot book name)
I did already mention bats, yet whilst re-reading Mossflower which has the bats in, I can see all the more they had potential as characters to be added in more, and with some clothing and more civilised identity as opposed to the wilder creatures like herons and snakes which didn't so much. Why not? Lots of other little mammals were included. Sure they like the dark mostly, but they could have had a presence in night time scenes.
The Moles. Yes, I know they are in every book, but they always get supporting roles. Every good species had at least one main character, but there was not a single mole Abbot or wielder of martin's sword. Moles have been proven time and time again to be honest, kind, and wise creatures, but Jacques kept them in the supporting cast. Also, the voles had a lot of potential, but aside from Yoofus Lightpaw in Rakkety Tam, Voles barely got a character to represent them!
The voles, the moles, please no trolls.
:D
Like many have said, it would've been cool to see more bats and more sparrows. I also would've liked more owls. I didn't realize the sparrow died out after Mattimeo. That's really sad :'(
Quote from: Rivertheotter on February 22, 2015, 07:45:04 PM
The Moles. Yes, I know they are in every book, but they always get supporting roles. Every good species had at least one main character, but there was not a single mole Abbot or wielder of martin's sword. Moles have been proven time and time again to be honest, kind, and wise creatures, but Jacques kept them in the supporting cast. Also, the voles had a lot of potential, but aside from Yoofus Lightpaw in Rakkety Tam, Voles barely got a character to represent them!
The voles, the moles, please no trolls.
WHAT?! No trolls?! How dare you! As a respected cave troll I feel insulted.
;)
I agree with the moles, and up until The Sable Quean I kind of felt the same way. However, in that book Axtel Sturnclaw more than made up for generations of moles for how awesome he was.
Two that I really think were Turtles and Hamsters. It would have been so cool to see Hamsters live at Redwall, or somehow make a book on them. Turtles I found would make a good run in character on adventures and maybe have an old one at Redwall.
I'm not so sure about hamsters...
Just what could they bring to the table to help them stand out from the other rodents???
Quote from: JangoCoolguy on February 24, 2015, 04:34:58 AM
I'm not so sure about hamsters...
Just what could they bring to the table to help them stand out from the other rodents???
Their look, that's just about it.
I think he should have used wolves more, mainly because that's my favorite animal, but, hey you've got to admit they're cool, it's the type of animal you would probably freak out if you saw just roaming around.
Another creature you see only once is Gerbils but they aren't really even Gerbils their Jerbil Rats, which is disappointing because they could have made interesting villains.
Quote from: LT Sandpaw on February 25, 2015, 03:14:56 PM
Another creature you see only once is Gerbils but they aren't really even Gerbils their Jerbil Rats, which is disappointing because they could have made interesting villains.
Actually, the Jerbilrats were
jerboa, which is quite a different species from gerbils (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerboa). (Ironically, the word "gerbil" was a shortened version of "jerboa")
Though now that you mention it, it would've been nice if we'd seen some again in a desert adventure. They'd be like a cross between rats and hares. Probably morally ambiguous like some shrews and voles. One or two could've even helped the good guys out.
Quote from: The Skarzs on February 23, 2015, 05:53:30 PM
Quote from: Rivertheotter on February 22, 2015, 07:45:04 PM
The Moles. Yes, I know they are in every book, but they always get supporting roles. Every good species had at least one main character, but there was not a single mole Abbot or wielder of martin's sword. Moles have been proven time and time again to be honest, kind, and wise creatures, but Jacques kept them in the supporting cast. Also, the voles had a lot of potential, but aside from Yoofus Lightpaw in Rakkety Tam, Voles barely got a character to represent them!
The voles, the moles, please no trolls.
WHAT?! No trolls?! How dare you! As a respected cave troll I feel insulted.
;)
I agree with the moles, and up until The Sable Quean I kind of felt the same way. However, in that book Axtel Sturnclaw more than made up for generations of moles for how awesome he was.
True, Axtel was pretty awesome, but he's the exception. Also, He wasn't the main character, and at first he just felt like a deus ex machina, but I liked how he was a warrior who stuck to the whole mole sweetness thing. also, I meant internet trolls. cave trolls would have been awesome ;D
I think Shark, and I think nooooo. That would be like a book's version of the Battlefield Megaladon, especially comparing the size to the woodlanders. I would have loved to see more hamsters, as they would be really interesting creatures, and their nervous personality in real life could be reflected incredibly well and end up rather humorous.
Quote from: Rivertheotter on February 27, 2015, 11:08:08 PM
Quote from: The Skarzs on February 23, 2015, 05:53:30 PM
Quote from: Rivertheotter on February 22, 2015, 07:45:04 PM
The Moles. Yes, I know they are in every book, but they always get supporting roles. Every good species had at least one main character, but there was not a single mole Abbot or wielder of martin's sword. Moles have been proven time and time again to be honest, kind, and wise creatures, but Jacques kept them in the supporting cast. Also, the voles had a lot of potential, but aside from Yoofus Lightpaw in Rakkety Tam, Voles barely got a character to represent them!
The voles, the moles, please no trolls.
WHAT?! No trolls?! How dare you! As a respected cave troll I feel insulted.
;)
I agree with the moles, and up until The Sable Quean I kind of felt the same way. However, in that book Axtel Sturnclaw more than made up for generations of moles for how awesome he was.
True, Axtel was pretty awesome, but he's the exception. Also, He wasn't the main character, and at first he just felt like a deus ex machina, but I liked how he was a warrior who stuck to the whole mole sweetness thing. also, I meant internet trolls. cave trolls would have been awesome ;D
It's obvious many people feel moles need a main role, but we need to realize they already do. Moles rarely fight, so it may feel that they need to. But moles are the engineers of the books. Without them, the characters would be stuck down a hole, with no Dinny to dig them out. Look at the books, the moles are already vital characters.
Quote from: Sagetip, the hare on March 02, 2015, 03:01:40 PM
It's obvious many people feel moles need a main role, but we need to realize they already do. Moles rarely fight, so it may feel that they need to. But moles are the engineers of the books. Without them, the characters would be stuck down a hole, with no Dinny to dig them out. Look at the books, the moles are already vital characters.
Thank you!
Let's please stay focused...
If there's something that this series is missing, that's wolves. Because, (and I'm quoting the OP here), COME ON.
But aside for that, I think that the series keeps a nice balance in between its species (when it's not giving unlimited power to the Badgers, that is).
Lynxes! Maybe as a neutral species. It would most likely be a bad species but it would be fun to see it be good for a while.
Quote from: CpnRake335 on February 21, 2015, 04:39:04 PM
the sparra were killed off by Ironclaw's crows and Malkeris? archers in Mattemeo, its a pity they died out
and while there has been a hedgehog hero, they are never the main hero, same with moles
Did you know there was a beaver in the series that was only mentioned in one book, Redwall
Rabbits, mentioned in Martin the Warrior
and a golden hamster somewhere (forgot book name)
They survived. The survivors regrouped and then they reproduced.
Quote from: Delthion on March 11, 2015, 02:42:55 AM
Lynxes! Maybe as a neutral species.
Better yet, morally ambiguous. A creature that makes plays by its own rules and owes allegiance to no beast that help or hinder vermin and woodlander alike depending on its mood.
Quote from: JangoCoolguy on March 11, 2015, 05:00:44 PM
Quote from: Delthion on March 11, 2015, 02:42:55 AM
Lynxes! Maybe as a neutral species.
Better yet, morally ambiguous. A creature that makes plays by its own rules and owes allegiance to no beast that help or hinder vermin and woodlander alike depending on its mood.
Yes. I usually appreciate morally ambiguous characters if they're important. Minor characters like this often just annoy me.
Quote from: CpnRake335 on February 21, 2015, 04:39:04 PM
and a golden hamster somewhere (forgot book name)
Mokug the Golden Hamster from
Triss. I mentioned him a while back but it's on another page now.
They would have had to be given some unique, interesting characteristic to make them stand out, or they'd be too similar to mice. Like, I don't know, maybe they could have their own island or be farmers or be skilled in something not previously explored in the series. It's an interesting idea.
I have to agree on the bats, naturally. The few times we meet them were great (particularly in Outcast, as I recall them actually coming into the main plot a bit there), but I always wished there was a book where the bats were present through most of the story. Like, maybe there would be some obstacle our heroes faced that only the wings or ears of a bat could help overcome, and the bats end up playing an important role in saving the day, or we could even have an entire book set in and around Bat Mountpit. So many cool possibilities were left unexplored with the bats.
However, bats don't often come out during the day. That means that any book based on Bat Mountpit would have to mostly take place during the night.
Quote from: Izeroth on March 27, 2015, 03:38:00 AM
However, bats don't often come out during the day. That means that any book based on Bat Mountpit would have to mostly take place during the night.
I don't see that being much of a problem. After all, more than one good animal fiction series has managed to write itself effectively around nocturnal or subterranean characters (
Silverwing being the most notable example, since it's actually about bats). It's not impossible to write an engaging story that mostly takes place in the dark, it just takes a bit of imagination and cleverness. Plus then there's the Mountpit itself, which consists of a vast network of caverns and tunnels; there's lots of interesting things that could be done with a location like that, and it would have been pretty cool to explore it all more in-depth at some point.
Bats... bats... bats!
They are hard to give a main role. Bats can't grasp a weapon (well, they can, but they could only fight while flyiing) it's been proven that they are no match for creatures on the ground, and they are overall helpless against enemy weapons, as proven in Outcast. However, they must be treated with respect, as they doplay a helpful role in Mossflower, giving Dinny a chance to prove his cunning, if nothing else. (and believe me, they did help a lot in that book). As a result, these two thing cancel out to give bats a supporting role. If they happened to be part of a band of traveers, they would most likely be a night scout and healer, for their part.
Now, I haven't read Silverwings, or any bat-based book, for that matter, and those seperate series may explain more ways to make bats a main character. For now, though, they will most likely keep a supporting role in fanfics and RPs.
Bats certainly seem more suited for supporting characters, like moles, but they could have been able to hold bigger roles. For example, ever heard of "bats in the belfry" (bell tower)? Why didn't they ever have bats roost in the bell tower? With such creatures living in such an area, that would have been a good advantage for the abbey dwellers. If bats had taken residence somewhere in the abbey, they would have come into contact with somebeast eventually, and I can see that adding an interesting ingredient into the books.
Anything that fly's and has an intelligent brain would be a dangerous enemy or an excellent friend. Bats with their Echolocation only more so. The occasional Hunting hawk proves this point on their deadly capability.
Dolphins could have a bigger role similar to the ones in Legend of Luke along with Sea Otters
Dolphins? I don't ever remember dolphins in the stories. . .
In LoL they pull the raft after Beau mistakes them for sharks
Oh, right; thanks!
Quote from: Bella on April 05, 2015, 02:54:27 AM
Dolphins could have a bigger role similar to the ones in Legend of Luke along with Sea Otters
I don't know...
Seals can play the same role, but better with the bonus of being more dexterous and able to go on land. Sea lions more so. Kinda wish we'd seen a couple of more of those alongside some seals.
The sea lion from LOL was fun becauuse he had understandable English.
(honestly, Bosie was harder to understand)
Heh.
Dolphins really wouldn't be anything better than a one-scene sort of thing, because it's not like they can do much other than squeak and look graceful. . . in the water. Seals might have been a bit more noticeable, but once again, I feel their role as just a supporting, once-in-a-while role is reasonably placed due to their confinement to the shore-areas, as well them being to funny-looking I can't think of them any other way than as comic relief. :D
Yay solid aquatic animals really would take much more then temporary role, It would have been cool to see whales more often though, they would have to be massive and could easily be and island for most Redwallers.
Birds. Not enough birds.
y no mice ride birdies?
And teh beevirs.
And turtils. Turtils = need 2 hav.
Quote from: Blaggut on April 21, 2015, 05:53:54 PM
And teh beevirs.
And turtils. Turtils = need 2 hav.
The issue there is that those aren't native to the UK and Jacques wanted to mainly focus on native species.
Beavers went extinct over there in the 16th Century--Redwall's initial setting--so Jacques had to avoid it in future tales (which he didn't even intend to happen to start with). Heck, there were other species who the did the same job just as well, mainly otters and moles.
The worst part is that the Beaver didn't leave an impression. Heck, he was cut from the TV Show
and the Graphic Novel and it had no effect on the story at all. Poor dope >_<
Though there is a turtle/tortoise in
Rakkety Tam, Rockbottom. He didn't talk, but still had some personality. Though he was treated more like a living plot device than a character.
It would've been interesting if some sentient turtles had appeared at some point. They would've come with their own armor!
Quote from: James Gryphon on February 04, 2015, 08:50:34 PM
The way that almost all birds seemed to become completely good is one of the strangest alignment changes in the series.
In the first book, Redwall, we have (besides the Sparra) Captain Snow. While he's a "good guy" in as much as that he's friends with several other protagonists, this alignment is a little shaky, given his propensity to eat mice and shrews. Mossflower famously features Argulor, as well as an unnamed owl at Bat Mountpit. While some (including myself) have made the case that Argulor wasn't exactly a villain, he isn't a protagonist either. At this point in the series, birds of prey seem to be aligned towards evil (or at least antagonistic).
...and then, from Mattimeo onwards, this radically changes. Sir Harry the Muse and Stryk Redkite both appear as invaluable allies for the protagonists. Mariel also features a good owl who saves the main characters' hides. Salamandastron and Martin the Warrior feature birds of prey that are aggressive and dangerous, but at the end of the books, they're all solid good guys. The Bellmaker also has an ally bird, although he leaves before the end of the book. Outcast, Skarlath... then Gerul and other good owls through Marlfox. I'm not going to continue; the point is pretty well made that birds of prey were all good.
So it's established this is a thing. The question is, why? It can't be their natural alignment; all of these rely on mice as a staple food. My best guess is that it has to do with the way they're viewed by the population at large. Most people think of birds of prey as noble animals. So, they are. Simple as that -- even though it seems to contradict their actual existence, where they continually feed on what the series has established are the good guys.
I think I preferred birds of prey as how they were portrayed in the first two books -- aggressive, a little mysterious, and extremely dangerous. It gave a little balance to the books, knowing that there was a creature around that could devour any of the main characters, and it required them to keep their wits about them. It doesn't help that some of the birds were used as deus ex machinas -- blatantly so in Mariel, where the heroes blunder into a trap and are only saved because an owl happened to be around.
On a side note, I liked your portrayal of an owl as a villain in your fanfiction about the bat, and hope that story is completed at some point.
I think he split the birds into 2 good/evil categories. Ravens, Vultures, Rooks, and some other Carrion birds were portrayed as the "evil" then the Birds of prey, Sparra, owls (captain snow was bad but was held to his word), and those were good because they are portrayed as Noble. There is one or two instances of other birds being used too like in Pearls of Lutra there was the thief that took on of the pearls. Birds are almost their own side story.
The role of birds isn't exactly clear in the stories. Some birds, like sparrows and hawks, are fully capable of thought and speech, while others, like wood pigeons, are apparently not sentient.
snakes, but not adders, cause normal snakes are cool too
Sharks ;D
Actually, seeing more of the marine beasts in general would have been cool.
Quote from: The Skarzs on April 02, 2015, 12:39:30 AM
Bats certainly seem more suited for supporting characters, like moles, but they could have been able to hold bigger roles. For example, ever heard of "bats in the belfry" (bell tower)? Why didn't they ever have bats roost in the bell tower? With such creatures living in such an area, that would have been a good advantage for the abbey dwellers. If bats had taken residence somewhere in the abbey, they would have come into contact with somebeast eventually, and I can see that adding an interesting ingredient into the books.
That was supossed to be the part that the Sparra played (and they did it magnificently, at least for the two books they starred in.)
Quote from: Skyblade on June 15, 2015, 03:46:04 PM
Sharks ;D
Actually, seeing more of the marine beasts in general would have been cool.
That would be actually very interesting to see (I can totally see them as a real danger in some of the books and the TV Series could have really used them in its third season).
Quote from: TheTaleOfSierra on June 15, 2015, 09:51:14 PM
That would be actually very interesting to see (I can totally see them as a real danger in some of the books and the TV Series could have really used them in its third season).
The events of Martin the Warrior took place on land. The only marine animal in the book was the giant fish that began playing with the boat in which Martin, Rose, Grumm, Felldoh, and Brome were escaping, and it was the fish's antics that cause the group to abandon ship and become separated. That scene was included in the TV series. There were many dissimilarities between the book and season 3 of the TV show, but the course of the show did stay true to the original source. Marine animals were useless and unnecessary in the book, as the battle and all events following that scene took place on land, with the short-lived exception of the group traveling by river on the otters' raft and in the shrews' longboats.
In other books in the series, however, marine animals do take a more active role. Seals, particularly, have toyed with vermin ships, as the Whoomers in The Rogue Crew did, and have led the protagonists out of tight spots, as Hawm and his seals did in Pearls of Lutra. I mentioned them earlier in this thread as the species I wish had made a greater presence in the books.
There was also a time where they stole a boat from the pirates and navigated a few miles, but I don't remember how it ends, how it connected to the story or if they encountered any beast (please don't tell me about it, I would like a reason to re-watch the series).
Those are still enough water scenarios to use sharks, though!
Quote from: TheTaleOfSierra on June 16, 2015, 11:10:35 PM
There was also a time where they stole a boat from the pirates and navigated a few miles, but I don't remember how it ends, how it connected to the story or if they encountered any beast (please don't tell me about it, I would like a reason to re-watch the series).
Those are still enough water scenarios to use sharks, though!
That scene to which you're referring ends with the scene I described above. This is the one deep-water scenario in the book, and the fish is the antagonist in that scene.
Quote from: Banya on June 18, 2015, 05:14:39 PM
Quote from: TheTaleOfSierra on June 16, 2015, 11:10:35 PM
There was also a time where they stole a boat from the pirates and navigated a few miles, but I don't remember how it ends, how it connected to the story or if they encountered any beast (please don't tell me about it, I would like a reason to re-watch the series).
Those are still enough water scenarios to use sharks, though!
That scene to which you're referring ends with the scene I described above. This is the one deep-water scenario in the book, and the fish is the antagonist in that scene.
In the second book of Luke it's all on water.
While scene s including deep sea animals makes for a good story, it's not fun to use it all the time unless you want readers anticipating a "surprise" monster attack. Sea monsters are supposed to be unpredictable. Also, in Luke, having a crippling sea monster attack on Luke's ship would make one too many scenes of them repairing the ship.
I wish they would have introduced more unique vermin tribes, such as the Flitchaye and the tree rats.
They make a lot of jokes and puns to species we never see.
I would of liked to see some deer and dogs.
Quote from: rexhyuga on June 28, 2015, 12:04:29 AM
They make a lot of jokes and puns to species we never see.
I would of liked to see some deer and dogs.
Well, given the way this series seems to use various animals as stand-ins for more typical fantasy creatures (large adders seem to have basically the same role as dragons, and we even get a "hydra" of sorts in
Triss), I could easily imagine deer acting as the
Redwall world's equivalent of a unicorn; rare, elusive, wise, and vaguely mystical. It's actually a concept I was planning to explore a bit if I'd gotten much farther with a fanfic I started a while back.
Oh how neat. that's a cool headcannon.
Quote from: SoranMBane on June 28, 2015, 12:40:33 AM
[Well, given the way this series seems to use various animals as stand-ins for more typical fantasy creatures (large adders seem to have basically the same role as dragons, and we even get a "hydra" of sorts in Triss), I could easily imagine deer acting as the Redwall world's equivalent of a unicorn; rare, elusive, wise, and vaguely mystical. It's actually a concept I was planning to explore a bit if I'd gotten much farther with a fanfic I started a while back.
Now that sounds cool! ;D