Outcast of Redwall is the best book in the series?

[sunflashtheace]

on rereading outcast I must say that it is the best book in the series second best would be redwall. Sorry friends for saying something about a book that I have not read much about yet

Flash on

[Nadaz, voice of the host]

Please don't double post if you forgot to say something than please hit the modify button please.🙂

[Dannflower Reguba]

       Honestly, Outcast has been one of my least favorite from the first time I've read it. Jaques attempted too many different things at once (such as Veil being raised at Redwall, the villain not really attacking a specific group, that one hare.... you know who I'm talking about -_-). Bryony annoyed me from the moment she showed up even though her style of character shouldn't elicit such a response. As the story continued, she felt like a ditz chasing after a fools passion with no solid reason to do so. The end was also terrible, there's no finality to it at all! The entire book is based around the concepts of vermin morality, and Veil didn't give any solid indication one way or another what he had become which really leaves the entire fan base stuck as to what they should think about the vermin vs. woodlander morality situation. It's so bad that anytime Outcast comes up, you're sure to see a debate about Veil's final act at the end, with no real conclusion being able to be drawn responsibly from the text because it's all based on interpretation.

       Outcast left me wanting, and sad (especially considering one of the most interesting characters in the entire book just dies out of the blue, and no, it's not Veil), and I have yet to forgive it for making me feel this way.

[The Grey Coincidence]

Yeah, to quote something i once read, it feels like Jacques started deconstructing his world, but never quite put it back together. I too was dissapointed by Skarlath's death.

[MeadowR]

I would disagree, too, that this is the best book in the series. I've given reasons in some other threads; one being the somewhat one-dimensional character of Bryony and a few other characters.

[Frank Clydth]

Agree to disagree that Marlfox is the best book in the series.

[Sanddunes]

Wasn't my favorite

[Ashleg]

Agreed.

[The Grey Coincidence]

Don't get me wrong I liked it, but I have to agree with Soran here, it felt a little crammed. The entire Veil plot (while my favourite part of the book) felt rushed. What would have been better, perhaps, was if the book had been split in two. Like the first book (by book I mean novel) is all about Sunflash and Skarlath and Swartt, and it ends with Veil being taken into the abbey.
Then you get another book (novel) that is direct a sequel to the first story, and you know... centers around the titular character.* That would have given us a lot more time to get to know Veil, I mean we saw him in what 10-ish chapters? I personally would have liked to see more of his childhood and stuff and then after he gets banished (the poisoning wouldn't have been a random occurrence if the Mr Jacques had enough time to build up to it) he can still go searching for his warlord father and stuff-but wouldn't it have been wonderfully ironic if Swartt was dead the entire time?
Food for thought, but I think it was a bit too much for one book.
*That was another thing that bothered me. Imagine if you read a Harry Potter book, and suddenly most of the story is about Dumbledore and Voldermort and then Harry comes out of nowhere and kills him. That would be pretty dull, right? Or if Percy Jackson was actually about Greek Mythology and didn't even have a character called Percy for most of the book...

[Lutra]

I haven't read this one in a while, but I do recall liking the fact that perhaps there is more to just having "good species" and "bad species" in Redwall to basically determine your lot in life.  I'd have to find my really old post on Redwall's gray characters.  I thought Veil was something unique.  A character that shows that nurturing might actually matter!  In the end, I think Brian Jacques showed that nurturing could exist in Redwall and make a difference.  He tried the same thing again in Taggerung.  I wish he had done more of this.  The whole Redwall series would've been far more interesting with more gray characters.

[Lutra]

Here is my very old post that spawned a lot of messages about gray characters.  It fits in with why I felt Outcast was one of the better books in the series.

http://www.redwallabbey.com/forum/index.php?topic=430.0

[Nadaz, voice of the host]

Thanks Lutra! In the future please edit your first post instead of double posting. 

[The Skarzs]

(Lol, Lutra's a mod.)

[MeadowR]

Ha!

You tell 'im, Nadaz.

[Lutra]

Wha??  The regulars boss me around??   You guys are brave bossing an otter mod around these parts.  We don't even speak of what is at the bottom of the Abbey pond when beasts around here don't behave.....you'll never see some things again! 

Nadaz, I am totally in agreement though that Redwall needed gray characters and it made Outcast amazing.