Redwall Abbey

Mariel with no weapon other than  a rope takes on 50 or so toads larger than her armed with spears and wins she then repeats feats like this with help from scorpions Dandin and the like throughout Mariel of Redwall and The Bellmaker such as lunching a successful raid on Fort Bladegart, defeating Gabool and fighting against the hordes of the Fox-Wolf Urgann Naru. I know your thinking that this is not true but keep in mind that I'm talking about who is more SKILLED not who is the best tactician or the strongest or the most powerful so I'm not saying that she is a  match for a badgerlord or Gulo but keep in mind that she she fought though 2 books with a rope not with a real weapon let alone the sword of martin

I'll go with characters are as power as they to be at a certain time. The thing is most main characters could have done the same thing if Brian wanted them to but to me one of the most skilled was Boar the fighter but I need to read the books again to see who else because Boar is a skill sword fighter and they're other types of fighting styles creatures use in the series

I'd have to say most of the otters would be actually. Deadly accurate with a sling which is not the easiest thing to and can actually use it in melee combat. Most of the time they are facing sword or spear wielding opponents without much more then a short piece of rope with a rock in the end. This wouldn't be easy to say the least. Most also seem to be decent with a dagger or knife. I'm seriously curious to see how a skipper would fight against someone with a spear at close range.

Quote from: Nadaz, voice of the host on November 26, 2017, 01:29:54 PM
Mariel with no weapon other than  a rope takes on 50 or so toads larger than her armed with spears and wins she then repeats feats like this with help from scorpions Dandin and the like throughout Mariel of Redwall and The Bellmaker such as lunching a successful raid on Fort Bladegart, defeating Gabool and fighting against the hordes of the Fox-Wolf Urgann Naru. I know your thinking that this is not true but keep in mind that I'm talking about who is more SKILLED not who is the best tactician or the strongest or the most powerful so I'm not saying that she is a  match for a badgerlord or Gulo but keep in mind that she she fought though 2 books with a rope not with a real weapon let alone the sword of martin

In The Bellmaker she did take up a polearm when she did not have a rope, so it seems she was confident with other weapons as well.

Mariel's choice of weapon has always annoyed me. The most similar weapon used in real life is . . . Named something I cannot remember. But it is used more for crowd control, I believe. There are MUCH more effective weapons than a piece of rope with a knot. However, it may be Brian's way of showing Mariel's aversion to killing, so she uses that rather than, say, a mace and chain.

If this is the case, and she uses Gullwacker by choice, then it would take considerable skill to use it with any effect in battle.

So. . . Short answer, yes, she may be more skilled with being able to adapt and use any weapon, though it may not make her the best fighter.

She was very skilled but their are so many other skilled warriors and vermin who you could say are more powerful, but in the end of the day the best character is NED JK JK no I would say cluny skill wise because he used literally everything on him to fight, tail, claws, etc, but that didn't save him in the end so yes Mariel is the most skilled warrior but that is all she is. SKILLED.

Thanks that was my point exactly.

       Rakkety Tam, Martin, any Long Patrol Hare worth their salt (and their consumption). All of these characters exhibit great skill in combat, including creatures that are many times their size (Rakkety Tam fought a wolverine, Martin fought Tsarmina). Toads are like the goombas of Redwall, slow and predictable, which makes their defeat somewhat underwhelming. Gabool hardly counted at the end as well, considering his combat prowess was already under question from getting completely WREKT by her fist earlier in the book. He was a conniving scoundrel.... and didn't he just fall into the scorpion pit anyway? Mariel was, arguably, the biggest Mary Sue of the series (emphasis on arguably), which has watered down her victories. We see other characters struggle in their fights so we learn how they operate during combat. The same cannot be said for Mariel as she had one tactic all the way through, "hit it with a rope."

       In conclusion, no, we do not receive enough information about whether or not she actually has skill to be comparing her with the characters who have taken on actual varieties of challenge and have had to deal with situations that weren't solved by the classic, "I'm the protagonist!"

Ouch. Dan- 1 Mariel- 0

Good points, Dan.

I think the most powerful fighter in the entire Redwall series was either the Redwall bell or Martin's sword. The former because it took out Cluny, the latter because it has killed more than anything or anyone in the entire series.
Though I'd say Boar the Fighter was probably the best in my memory, purely because he taught Martin the Warrior basically a tonne of stuff about fighting (there was a very memorable line which I can no longer quote...). Though let's be honest it's pretty hard for anyone to top a badger.

The bell and the sword are objects, not fighters...

       Wouldn't that just make it all the more impressive that they have some of the most influential kills to their names? Seeing as many warriors will go through multiple weapons in their careers. I realize your point Ash, I just think that Grey's point is humorous enough to be acknowledged for its' merit.

So it was a joke?

They wouldn't have been able to do anything without the wielder. As for the bell, Matthias cut that thing down.

Quote from: Ashleg on March 19, 2018, 06:02:31 PM
So it was a joke?

Most of my posts are one way or another...

(http://www.freedigitalphotos.net/images/previews/shrugging-man-10067338.jpg)

Quote from: Nadaz, voice of the host on November 26, 2017, 01:29:54 PM
SKILLED

She certainly had authorial fiat on her side since it stretches the imagination of her being able to defeat fifty opponents with spears, especially when armour is worn so little in redwall. How such a fight would have gone in reality would have ended with mariel being skewered with a dozen spears or so. In addition, how do you judge skill when a character uses something like a knotted rope as a weapon; I don't know bout any of you but I've never fought with a knotted rope in HEMA.

As for who I think is the most skilled, my answer would be one of the hares, badgers or perhaps marten. There was also that one....ferret I think he was, from Salamandastron who used a rapier and dueled with a hare briefly, he can be a runner up.