Why Does Martin Not Love Again?

[Duxwing]

Dear Forum,

Though I know that the continuity of the story demands that Martin never produce any descendants, I've never understood why he never loves again after Laterose dies, for although losing a lover is saddening indeed, a contradiction in the story emerges when one considers all of the other emotional trials that Martin endures without so much as a whimper.  Perhaps Martin's loss of resilience did not actually occur during battle, wherein the rush of adrenaline could have masked his grief, but afterward, once his shaking paws' had stilled and his thundering heart returned to calm.  His grief could have then returned--with a vengeance.

And the same logic could apply to the rest of his difficulties: stress locked everything away until the threat was gone, but the threat remained until Badrang was dead and the slaves were freed.  If so, then not only did Martin experience the grief of Rose's death, but every other negative emotion that his charged-up mind had locked away.  In such a state, seeing erratic behavior--an oath to never love again--would be expected of even the toughest creatures.  Yet the problem of follow-through remains, for the pain, however great, would one day subside, and a pretty mousemaid would catch Martin's eye. 

I have no better explanation for this than Martin following his word as a warrior--perhaps the oath not to love again was part of a larger one--but even then, he should have seen the light of reason in his many seasons at Redwall.  Any ideas?

-Duxwing

[GeminyaTome]

The same thing happens to real people today. Sometimes, grief hits so hard, that one struggles to recover. He didn't loose his love, he just never loved in the same way. Laterose was more to him than anyone again ever was.

[Duxwing]

The same thing happens to real people today.

Yes, but usually not to people who can shrug off mortal danger day in and day out.

Sometimes, grief hits so hard, that one struggles to recover.

Martin would have had many seasons to recover, and many creatures to help him.  Moreover, he was certainly emotionally stable enough to go on battling vermin in Mossflower Wood.

He didn't loose his love, he just never loved in the same way.

It's a figure of speech.

Laterose was more to him than anyone again ever was.

But surely, among all the creatures of Redwall Abbey, a similar mousemaid couldn't be found?  What a tremendous string of bad luck: Rose dies, Martin loses his mind with grief, battle doesn't clear his head, no other mousemaid can ever compare... etc. etc.  My pet theory is that Martin, in his later years, wasn't grieving, but pouting like a dibbun:

[ABBESS GERMAINE and MARTIN THE WARRIOR sit on a bench on the Abbey Grounds at Noon]
Abbess Germaine: (pointing to a mousemaid) Look at her, Martin, she's beautiful!
Martin: (crossing his arms, sticking his lower lip out) Rose's fur was darker.
AG: Oh, or that one!  Listen to her sing!
Martin: Rose's voice was higher.
...ad liberatum, ad infinitum

-Duxwing

[HeadInAnotherGalaxy]

Love and fightin' are tvo completely different zubjectz. Juzt becauze zomevone can 'andle vone doeznae mean zey can 'andle ze ozer.

[Lutra]

Dux, I've seen your debates so this ought to be interesting.

I'd say Martin does not love again simply because he pushes the brutal memory aside and fills his time with the founding of Redwall after the defeat the wildcats.  He simply could be too busy to find time for love in the sense that he had with Rose.  Another argument could be that nobody ever measured up to Rose, and thus he could never love as he loved Rose.  A third argument could be made as that some people upon the death of their spouse choose to remain single until their death and never remarry.  This could apply to Martin as well.

This topic is a bunch of subjective ideas anyway so no answer is absolute or 100% correct or incorrect for that matter.

[Duxwing]

Dux, I've seen your debates so this ought to be interesting.

Wow, thanks! 

I'd say Martin does not love again simply because he pushes the brutal memory aside

Forgive me my density in saying this, but how does pushing the memory aside factor in?

and fills his time with the founding of Redwall after the defeat the wildcats.  He simply could be too busy to find time for love in the sense that he had with Rose.

So he becomes consumed by--or one could even say, married to--his work?  Oh, wait a minute!  I don't recall any members of the "Order" ("no hidden messages," my left claw!) of Redwall ever marrying, and if Martin founded the Order, then he, too would have never married--perhaps even starting the tradition of celibacy despite later wanting to marry.  He might also have wanted to avoid starting a dynasty of kings and queens, making his not marrying again essential.  Indeed, Martin could have very well loved another mouse after Laterose: he just didn't marry her and saw to it that no record of it were made.

Another argument could be that nobody ever measured up to Rose, and thus he could never love as he loved Rose.

The laws of statistics indicate that somebeast would have measured up eventually.

A third argument could be made as that some people upon the death of their spouse choose to remain single until their death and never remarry.  This could apply to Martin as well.

A little bit unlikely considering just how tough Martin is.

This topic is a bunch of subjective ideas anyway so no answer is absolute or 100% correct or incorrect for that matter.

We might never know with certainty, but I think that we could find the most likely answer using the clues from the text.

-Duxwing

[Ungatt Trunn]

I never thought of that.
Yes, I do think that Rose's death would have a huge impact on Martin, which would probably lead to having it hard for him to find love or no love at all.

[ABBESS GERMAINE and MARTIN THE WARRIOR sit on a bench on the Abbey Grounds at Noon]
Abbess Germaine: (pointing to a mousemaid) Look at her, Martin, she's beautiful!
Martin: (crossing his arms, sticking his lower lip out) Rose's fur was darker.
AG: Oh, or that one!  Listen to her sing!
Martin: Rose's voice was higher.
...ad liberatum, ad infinitum

[Leatho Shellhound]

Maybe Martin was afraid that he might lose the new "rose". That if he loved a maid again and she died he wouldn't be able to stand it. Just a thought..... Oh and Laterose's niece looked just like her, so there were other mouse maids that could match her. And since Laterose's brother had a daughter that looked that way, that means the gene came from their parents or grandparents. So that means there might even have been other family members who looked like that. Maybe Rose had a cousin her age that looked like or even better than her.

[GeminyaTome]

Martin probably just never fell in love again!! It happens to many people today. Or, he just never felt led to marriage.

[Shadowed One]

It doesn't matter why he did not marry, the point is, he didn't.

[Vilu Daskar]

Because he only loves Rose.

[Maudie]

Oh, wait a minute!  I don't recall any members of the "Order" ("no hidden messages," my left claw!) of Redwall ever marrying,

Spoiler

Abbess Perrit in Doomwyte was married

[close]

[Rusvul]

It doesn't matter if there was another mousemaid like Rose, he wasn't seeking to replace her. She was the only one ever like her. It's not about how she looked, and perhaps Rose's death just shattered him so completely, perhaps nobeast else ever caught his eye. I don't think that a specific reasoning is needed, just, he never really loved anybeast else.

[Duxwing]

Maybe Martin was afraid that he might lose the new "rose". That if he loved a maid again and she died he wouldn't be able to stand it. Just a thought..... Oh and Laterose's niece looked just like her, so there were other mouse maids that could match her. And since Laterose's brother had a daughter that looked that way, that means the gene came from their parents or grandparents. So that means there might even have been other family members who looked like that. Maybe Rose had a cousin her age that looked like or even better than her.

Your idea makes sense: Martin certainly had PTSD.

It doesn't matter if there was another mousemaid like Rose, he wasn't seeking to replace her. She was the only one ever like her.

Sure, but that leaves open the infinite set of all possible mousemaids.

It's not about how she looked, and perhaps Rose's death just shattered him so completely, perhaps nobeast else ever caught his eye.

Then why wasn't he more upset throughout the book?  He certainly went on quite the killing spree.

I don't think that a specific reasoning is needed, just, he never really loved anybeast else.

It doesn't matter why he did not marry, the point is, he didn't. 

This thread is all about trying to figure out why.

Because he only loves Rose.

At some point in time, Martin did not love Rose; therefore, he is capable of falling in love with Rose, and likely anybeast like her.

-Duxwing

[Shadowed One]

But the point is, there may have been, and probably was, a mouse like Rose. The thing is, she might not have lived during Martin's lifetime.