Magic in Mossflower (OOC Discussion/Sign-up)

[Shy-Guy]

So, I have always been interested in fantasy combat. Redwalls combat in particular has always enthralled me, but yet I wondered: 'What could possibly make this better?'. That's when the answer came to me , magic.

Now, magic isn't really a thing in the Redwall series. There are glimpses of a possible afterlife, and perhaps a broad type of mysticism, but the purpose of this roleplay will be purely to explore the possibilities of magic within Redwall. An AU RP of sorts.

The 'magick' system I have set up is similar to that of Nickelodeons "Avatar: The Last Airbender" with there being four elemental magicks: Air, Earth, Fire, Water. I have added my own types of magick, of course. Life and Death magick, and 'Holy' and 'Cursed' magick.

I may end up removing the last two from this roleplay, because I'm not sure I want to get into the dangerous territory that is religion. Anyways! I'll quickly list down the power scales of each type of magic for everyone's easy understanding:

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Life Magick is the most powerful Magick in the world. Only the Magick One, the Eight Saints

Spoiler

(Those fellows will be explained if I decide to use Holy and Cursed Magick)

[close]

and a few Magickans can successfully use it. Many Magickans who try to use this Magick end up dying from exhaustion. Life Magick is completely untainted, being the essence of the Magick One themselves.
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Holy Magick is often used by angels, the Magick Ones celestial soldiers that reside in the Aether. This magic is best utilized when in combat with demons of the Nether and undead creatures. Living Magickans who master Holy Magick are usually clerics, nuns, and monks.
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Cursed Magick is used by demons and fallen rangels in that roam the Nether. Living Magickans who practice Cursed Magick more often than not will be corrupted by it's power
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Death Magick is used in the UnderWorld, where most souls end up. Death Magick is used to reincarnate recently deceased creatures, and most Magickans who use it are already on the slippery slope towards Cursed Magick.
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Water Magick is used by folks who live in costal areas, by seas, lakes, and other bodies of water. Water Magickians are usually fishers or sailors. Of it's many uses, it is an excellent counter to Fire Magick.
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Earth Magixk is used by people who live in mountainous areas and barren, rocky regions. Some non-religious monks may also practice Earth Magick along with Air Magick.
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Fire Magick is a common form of Magick, being used in forests and plains. Those who live near active or non-active volanoes can quickly master it. Fire Magick is mainly used for combat purposes.
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Air Magick is used in mountain ranges, much like Earth Magick. In fact, the two forms of Magick can be learned together.
--

Now that that's all out of the way, I can discuss what I wish to roleplay here. This 'AU' can still be set in Mossflowee, but there may not necessarily be a 'Redwall Abbey'. There likely will be, but it might not be visited.

The premise I had is simple really. In this AU of mine, there are eight powerful relics that enhance each of the eight types of magic. I propose we have two groups of creatures. Now keep in mind, not every vermin is 'evil' and not every woodbeast is 'good'

Group 'A' wishes to collect all of the Eight Relics in order to conquer Mosslfower. Their followers may or may not entirely agree with them.

Group 'B' wishes to collect all of the Relics in order to stop Group 'B' and protect Mossflower.

I will control NPC's in both groups if not enough people sign up. Ideally there would be eight people on each team. One leader, one 'right-hand man', at least three officers, who may be specialized in some task, and three crew members.

The groups will start out in Mossflower, and may go back and forth across the country side in search of the relics. (As I have not established where these relics are hidden yet  ) As for what the relics themselves are, I'm just gonna cop out and have them be jewels.

That's just the jist of it, at least, and I hope maybe I will be able to work the kinks out with you guys.

[Verdauga]

Shy, here are a few things I'm thinking that might put a dampener on your plans.

1. Life and Death Magic is about as religious as Holy and Cursed Magic.

Death Magick is used in the UnderWorld, where most souls end up. Death Magick is used to reincarnate recently deceased creatures, and most Magickans who use it are already on the slippery slope towards Cursed Magick.

The idea of an afterlife is almost purely religious, and at least superstitious. Not saying that you can't or shouldn't use them, but if you were to remove Holy and Cursed magic to avoid the can of worms of religion, Life and Death magic should be tossed as well.

2. The potential duality of Earth and Air magic could make it more dangerous than Fire and Water magic. A dust storm conjured by one of these magickans could counter the attacks of both Fire and Water users, and blind them. Once again, not saying not to use it, but this is something to think about.

3.You use the term 'Magickans' which implies that there are some who don't use magic, and some special people who do. If a player chose not to have the ability to use magic, they would be placed at an inherent disadvantage to a player who does. It could be balanced out, I'm sure, but it's something to think about.

4. Due to the different timezones, this RP could take a while to finish, so be prepared for a potentially year-long time investment. The length of the plotline could also cause the RP to die. Beware of that.

5. Lastly, I think it unlikely that you'll be able to garner sixteen players. Not because of the RP, but because there aren't many more than eighteen active forum-goers.

Of course, these are my opinions and in no way are you obligated to consider them, but I hope you do, and I hope this helps.

[Shy-Guy]

Some very good points there. To be honest, I didn't want it to appear that I was completely copying Avatar. I could tweak it up in a few ways though, given time to really think about it. Could also make it smaller teams. Maybe two groups of four. Thank you for the suggestions!

[Verdauga]

Happy to help. I also added a point which I'll quote here

3.You use the term 'Magickans' which implies that there are some who don't use magic, and some special people who do. If a player chose not to have the ability to use magic, they would be placed at an inherent disadvantage to a player who does. It could be balanced out, I'm sure, but it's something to think about.

I'd be down to pop in occasionally, but I can't guarantee that I'll be a regular poster.

[Shy-Guy]

Of course, like in most fantasy genres, not everyone can use magic. While those who can master the 'mystic arts' if you will, will undoubtedly have an inherent advantage against others when it comes to combat, these creatures are not completely overpowered. My system of Magic does not work on mana, but stamina. Magick users have to be physically fit in order to use their skills. They have to be well rested. A magick user who is caught off his guard or attempting to rest can likely be overpowered.

[shisteer of nothing much]

This sounds quite fascinating. I'm in. I'll get a character up when I understand more of how it works.

[Verdauga]

Of course, like in most fantasy genres, not everyone can use magic. While those who can master the 'mystic arts' if you will, will undoubtedly have an inherent advantage against others when it comes to combat, these creatures are not completely overpowered. My system of Magic does not work on mana, but stamina. Magick users have to be physically fit in order to use their skills. They have to be well rested. A magick user who is caught off his guard or attempting to rest can likely be overpowered.

Good point, and fair trade. I'm interested to see how it turns out.

[Shy-Guy]

Of course, Ive taken a long look at the 'holy' and 'cursed' magic. I think I can justify why I would include it. One might say, 'Shy-Guy, this is just a rip on Christianity with Heaven and Hell'. To that I say, not necessarily.

In religion and folklore, 'Hell' is an afterlife or a location in which 'evil' souls are subjected to immense suffering, often torture as eternal punishment after death. Religions with a linear divine history often depict hells as eternal destinations, the biggest examples of which are; of course, Christianity and Islam. Whereas religions with reincarnation usually depict a hell as an intermediary period between incarnations, as is the case in the dharmic religions. Religions typically locate hell in another dimension or under Earth's surface. Other afterlife destinations include Heaven, Paradise, Purgatory, Limbo, the Underworld, etc.

Other religions, which do not conceive of the afterlife as a place of punishment or reward, merely describe an abode of the dead, the grave, a neutral place that is located under the surface of Earth. Such places are sometimes equated with the English word hell, though a more correct translation would be "underworld" or "world of the dead". The ancient Mesopotamian, Greek, Roman, and Finnic religions include entrances to the underworld from the land of the living.

In my case, what I have done here is created both scenarios. A heaven and a hell and an underworld. Another argument that may come up is 'Shy-Guy' demons and angels are CLEARLY supernatural beings predominant in Christianity.' To that I also say 'not necessarily.'

The Ancient Greek word 'δαίμων' (daemon) denotes a spirit or divine power, much like the Latin 'genius' or 'numen'. By the early Roman Empire, cult statues were seen, by pagans and their Christian neighbors alike, as inhabited by the numinous presence of the gods. Like pagans, Christians still sensed and saw the gods and their power, and as something, they had to assume, lay behind it, by an easy traditional shift of opinion they turned these pagan daimones into malevolent 'demons', the troupe of Satan..... Far into the Byzantine period Christians eyed their cities' old pagan statuary as a seat of the demons' presence. It was no longer beautiful, it was infested.

Now, onto the topic of angels. The word angel arrives in modern English from Old English 'engel' (with a hard g) and the Old French 'angele.' Both of these derive from Late Latin 'angelus' (literally "messenger"), which in turn was borrowed from Late Greek 'ἄγγελος' (angelos). Abrahamic religions often depict them as benevolent celestial intermediaries between God (or Heaven) and humanity. Other roles include protectors and guides for humans, and servants of God. Abrahamic religions describe angelic hierarchies, which vary by sect and religion. Some angels have specific names (such as Gabriel or Michael) or titles (such as seraph or archangel).

So, to put it very simply, in this AU, there would be celestial beings both good and evil. As for a religion itself, there would mainly be one. The religion, of Magick. Those who practice the religion don't necessarily have to practice Magick, though.

[shisteer of nothing much]

Fascinating. It sounds fairly well thought out.

[Shy-Guy]

Well, as Verdauga mentioned, there are a lot of kinks I need to work out. The combat system itself might become a bit rock-paper-scissory to balance it all out.

[shisteer of nothing much]

If you need any help, let me know. I don't know an awful lot about magic but you can still bounce ideas off me.

[Shy-Guy]

I will.

[MathLuk]

I am VERY interested. It turns out I'm not the only one to consider what hard magic Redwall would look like! Yay!

[Jarky Thistlebrush]

I wish I could do this, but if I did I'd probably end up dropping out sometime anyway. Big Secret Projects like mine require a lot of time.