Mossflower wood

[Osu]

Hmmmm... Was the path in the book Mossflower? Sorry I don't have the books in front of me. Because If it wasn't, maybe it was put in for travelers after redwall was built?

I can't remember, either - haven't read the book in a while. I'm pretty sure it wasn't, but there WAS  a ditch Martin and Co. had to polevault across.

[Captain Tammo]

I wonder where the ditch came from?

[Lutra]

^ See the Redwall topic in this section for the ditch discussion. Just read a lot about it and added my two pennies.


St. Ninians was an idea that just kind of fell out of favor once the churchmice went to live at Redwall.  Why keep bringing up the place, that apparently nobody in the abbey really knew much about?  Maybe it explains the path that others are mentioning here.  If the church was more active in times past, maybe St. Ninians had some sort of connection to the abbey, and thus a path was necessary.

[James Gryphon]

I just reread Mossflower, so maybe I might be able to take one or two educated guesses on some of these questions.

I believe the path outside Kotir (and presumably Redwall) was already said to be an old road, even by Mossflower. Bane came to Kotir by it; other than that, I don't think it saw much use in the story (since the Corim fought mostly a guerilla war).

As far as the ditch goes, if I had to take a guess, I'd think it might be connected somehow with the flooding tunnels the moles built into Kotir, but this is only a guess, and I don't remember whether we ever hear enough about the ditch itself to know for sure.

[martins#1fan]

Yes, I believe the ditch was for, if it ever flooded, it was there to hold some of the water.
However, It's not certain the Redwallers dug the ditch. They may have just bult the Abbey there because the ditch was there, and several other reasons too.

[Dotti]

I think the ditch is just sort of one of those things that we'll never know the answer to.  Maybe Brian Jaques didn't even create it with a history--it could be  just something that was convenient for Cluny's horde to hide it. But it's still fun to speculate!  
On the subject of the "This ain't Ninians" song, it is from The Legend of Luke, but it was sung by Windred, I believe.  Whoever sang it was in the cave with Luke, because a little one asked if Saint Ninians was real, and he responded with something like, "Aye, it's real enough; I was born there, and my wife Sayna too." 
On a completely random note, I've found that making up my own tunes to the songs from Redwall books and singing them is rather enjoyable.  Especially the song about "Algy and Bobbs and me" from....I think it's Rakkety Tam, and the song about the weasels  from Outcast of Redwall.  

[Lutra]

Could someone post that song, This Ain't Ninians?  I don't happen to own that book.  Sounds like an awfully good song.

[Log-a-Log]

I wonder what ever happened to Saint Ninian's in the later books

[Lutra]

^ I know the Redwallers destroyed the old church (after Mattimeo?) because the building had housed evil and was not being used as a home or church any longer.

[Dotti]

I could be wrong because I haven't read the book in forever, but I believe that the Redwallers burned it in Pearls of Lutra because magpies had moved in and when some Redwallers went in to get one of the pearls a magpie had stolen, the birds killed one of them.   I'll see if I can find the lyrics to Saint Ninians.

[Dotti]

Ok, here are the lyrics

Old Ninian mouse and his goodwife,
Needed a house to build,
They had a family grown so large,
Their tent was overfilled.

To setting sun the old wife toiled,
From daybreak in the east
But Ninian was a lazy mouse,
Who loved to sleep and feast.

The wife heaved stone and carried wood,
For door and wall and beam,
Whilst Ninian idly in daylight
Snored on in peaceful dream.

She raised the gables, built a roof,
Her back was bent and sore,
As Ninian ate up all the food,
And loudly called for more.

So when the house at last was built,
His wife nailed up a sign,
Which stated 'THIS AINT NINIANS!'
She said, 'That shows 'tis mine!'

Then when the countless seasons passed,
And all within had died
The rain and storm of ages long,
Had swept the sign outside.

It washed the first three letter out,
But left the rest intact,
That sign now reads, 'S AINT NINIANS!'
A church? A joke? A fact!
So traveler if you read the sign, Then take my word 'tis true,
A dreamer can because a saint,
So can a glutton too!

[Lutra]

^ Now that's a funny song!  Thanks for posting it!

[Osu]

I actually just read through the part with that song in it. And THEN I remembered reading it in grade school. It certainly does a lot to take out whatever religion there existed in the series, or implications thereof.

[Tiria Wildlough]

Where's it from???

[Lily]

As Dotti mentioned, Windred (Martin's grandmother) sang the song in Legend of Luke.

On the subject of the "This ain't Ninians" song, it is from The Legend of Luke, but it was sung by Windred, I believe.  Whoever sang it was in the cave with Luke, because a little one asked if Saint Ninians was real, and he responded with something like, "Aye, it's real enough; I was born there, and my wife Sayna too."