Top Characters You'd Like to Smack

[Maudie]

Well, he doesn't really "have a total meltdown" after Rose dies, but he does withdraw into himself for a season or two, but everyone needs time to get over a loss,

A season or two is a long time to a mouse:

Matthias and Cornflower have Mattimeo at the end of the Summer of the Late Rose (let us ignore the biological difficulties with such a feat for a moment).
Therefore, at the beginning of Mattimeo, Mattimeo is eight seasons old: no longer a dibbun, but not quite as old as Matthias is at the beginning of Redwall.  An eight year old human child would be incapable of the feats that Mattimeo performs, so the intuitive ratio of one season to one human year is unavailable; Perhaps two seasons equal one human year.  Jacques effectively said as much during a book signing in his twentieth year of writing, "I've been writing books for forty seasons," so my proposed ratio holds.

Therefore, if two Redwall seasons equate to one human year, Martin withdraws for almost a year.  Such a withdrawal is not only above normal for humans, but for Martin himself because plenty of his fellows die throughout the book, yet he only breaks as badly after Rose's death.

especially when the person who died was your true love,

Eugh.  "True love," my rump.  No such thing exists.  (I know full well that I sound grumpy and ornery in saying so, but no two people match each other perfectly).

and she died saving you,

I thought that she just died in battle while Martin watched.  If you have a copy, then I'd like to see a quote just to be sure (and, of course, to enjoy Jacques' beautiful prose once more  ).

and you have faced plenty of other deaths in your life,

But his nigh nonchalant experience of other deaths is precisely what bothers me when I attempt to understand his breakdown over Rose's death.  If they affected him enough to weigh upon him, then he should have broken down slowly, not all at once.

but I think that Martin deals with it pretty well, at least he doesn't brood over it for the rest of his life and never ever recover.

He does brood over it for the rest of his life, and he never recovers: he never falls in love again.

-Duxwing

I wouldn't say that just because he never loves again means he never recovers, many people either only love once, or never love at all, and it is not always because of a previous tragedy, but because they don't find the right person.
And I don't think he broods for the rest of his life, I mean, it still makes him sad and probably angry to think about it, but I think he accepts it and moves along.

[Duxwing]

I wouldn't say that just because he never loves again means he never recovers, many people either only love once, or never love at all, and it is not always because of a previous tragedy, but because they don't find the right person.

The mouse was in his twenties (relative to human years).  He had plenty of time and plenty of beasts.

And I don't think he broods for the rest of his life, I mean, it still makes him sad and probably angry to think about it, but I think he accepts it and moves along.

He would certainly brood over it whenever he felt love again.

-Duxwing

[Buzz_Bumble]

If you've got a newish version of the Flash plugin, then I've found a website where you can slap Simon Cowell (and other celebrities): Slap A Celebrity: Simon Cowell 

[Dannflower Reguba]

I wouldn't say that just because he never loves again means he never recovers, many people either only love once, or never love at all, and it is not always because of a previous tragedy, but because they don't find the right person.

The mouse was in his twenties (relative to human years).  He had plenty of time and plenty of beasts.

And I don't think he broods for the rest of his life, I mean, it still makes him sad and probably angry to think about it, but I think he accepts it and moves along.

He would certainly brood over it whenever he felt love again.

-Duxwing

Who cares if he decided to be a bachelor!? There's nothing wrong with that, he's a very normal mouse if you pay attention to him in the series, he's got ups, and he's got downs. Brian never took to marriages, so why marry Martin away? BTW, There is such a thing as what is often referred to as this "True love," though I wouldn't name it that, not going to talk about that here though as it could be somewhat inflammatory.

[Duxwing]

Who cares if he decided to be a bachelor!?

Uh, evidently you and I do because we're discussing it.     The anthropic principle of argument can be a badger like that.

There's nothing wrong with that,

The fact that he remained a bachelor his entire life is not in itself strange; however, the context of his previous love of Rose makes his later celibacy quite strange.

he's a very normal mouse if you pay attention to him in the series,

Except for that as far as I can remember, not only does he brood for seasons, but he never wants to talk to anyone involved with his Marshank campaign or return to Noonvale ever again.

he's got ups, and he's got downs.

Some very huge downs, I must say.

Brian never took to marriages, so why marry Martin away?

Are you sure about that?  Matthias married, and so did Mattimeo.  The marriage of many Abbeybeasts is also implied by its many Dibbuns and the stable population of creatures within Redwall Abbey.

BTW, There is such a thing as what is often referred to as this "True love," though I wouldn't name it that, not going to talk about that here though as it could be somewhat inflammatory.

I didn't mean to sound inflamed when I rebut True Love; go ahead, make your point.  I don't bite!   

-Duxwing

[Dannflower Reguba]

Who cares if he decided to be a bachelor!?

Uh, evidently you and I do because we're discussing it.     The anthropic principle of argument can be a badger like that.

There's nothing wrong with that,

The fact that he remained a bachelor his entire life is not in itself strange; however, the context of his previous love of Rose makes his later celibacy quite strange.

he's a very normal mouse if you pay attention to him in the series,

Except for that as far as I can remember, not only does he brood for seasons, but he never wants to talk to anyone involved with his Marshank campaign or return to Noonvale ever again.

he's got ups, and he's got downs.

Some very huge downs, I must say.

Brian never took to marriages, so why marry Martin away?

Are you sure about that?  Matthias married, and so did Mattimeo.  The marriage of many Abbeybeasts is also implied by its many Dibbuns and the stable population of creatures within Redwall Abbey.

BTW, There is such a thing as what is often referred to as this "True love," though I wouldn't name it that, not going to talk about that here though as it could be somewhat inflammatory.

I didn't mean to sound inflamed when I rebut True Love; go ahead, make your point.  I don't bite!   

-Duxwing

Strange? Possibly, but it didn't seem to me like he met many beasts that were his "type," per say.

One, His brooding is mainly in the Legend of Luke which is completely removed from Rose. Two He never gets the chance to talk with anyone from Noonvale.

Well duh (not to sound rude or anything) he loses literally everyone that really meant something to him when he was young [even Timballisto], he's had some pretty nice ups too.

Two distinct marriages and some implied or evident ones, but that's over 22 books, Brian lost a lot of possible romantic qualities that could have been incorporated (say for example, I always thought [and still think] that something HAD to happen between Dannflower and Songbreeze).

As for the last one, I'm avoiding it because it could be inflammatory to many people on the forum, which is why I'm going to continue refraining from posting my viewpoint on this issue   


Just a note to throw out there, I hope no one's taking this too seriously, I'm here to discuss, not to argue ("debating" if you will.  ) I in no way intend to come across as rude, or any of its' many synonyms. I WAS a little angry at first, but I've personally found this conversation to be quite... enjoyable? Not quite the word I'm looking for here, but it works. 

P.S. Duxwing, if you are curios, then just PM me about, like I said, that point crosses some boundaries placed on normal topics.

[Redwaller]

Life was hard on him but he should probably not have "shut himself down".

He went in shock.

[rachel25]

He just never met another creature like Rose and so he never loved again it does happen  sadly it happened to Martin I really cried when Rose died  Every time I read the part where she dies I cry and cry and cry       

[The Shade]

Whow!!!! MASSIVE Martin the warrior debate.

[Mariel]

I know Martin could sometimes be ridiculous,but who hasn't been?How would you feel if the one person you really ever felt anything in that way was killed by your worst enemy.Hello,do you not get that?

[Maudie]

I know Martin could sometimes be ridiculous,but who hasn't been?How would you feel if the one person you really ever felt anything in that way was killed by your worst enemy.Hello,do you not get that?

I know, right?

[HeadInAnotherGalaxy]

An' vith Roze it vaz probably zince around ze time zat e' vaz a zlave o' Marzhank e' 'ad tae be ztrong, ozervize 'e might 'ave broken dovn a long time ago. Zuddenly, 'e meetz ziz mouzemaid, an' zroughoot ze courze o' ze book zat ztrong barrier zat 'e 'ad up 'e zorta letz dovn an' by ze time o' ze final battle 'e lovez 'er. An' zen, juzt az zuddenly, juzt vhen everyzin' looked like it vould be made right ('e got iz fazer'z zvord back, Badrang 'az been defeated, Marzhank 'az fallen an' ze zlavez are free, 'e can live an' 'appy life at Noonvale vith Rose an' Grum an' zere friendz an' family, zey can aw finally live in peace again, etc...), Roze diez. Badrang 'az been defeated, Martin'z fazer'z zvord iz back vhere it belongz, ze zlavez are free, everyvone 'az been reunited at lazt, but Roze iz dead. Gone. Vhere 'e 'ad poured oot 'iz 'eart zere iz juzt emptinezz. Everyzin' iz okay again, but ze firzt an' only mouzemaid zat 'e 'ad 'ever loved an' vanted tae zpend ze rezt o' 'iz zeazonz viz iz gone. It iz zorta like 'ov vone day yer juzt ztandin' zere an' ziz object appearz bezide ye. Juzt vhen yer beginnin' tae get uzed tae truztin' zat it vill nae collapze if ye lean againzt it, it zuddenly iz pulled avay from ye, an' zere iz nozin' keepin' ye from loozin' yer balance an' favin' dovn.

'e doez eventually zorta get over it, but ye can zee 'ov it affectz ze rezt o' 'iz life. 'e never really lovez anyvone like Roze again, an' ze broodin' zroughoot Ze Legend O' Luke iz more aboot 'iz fazer an' tribe an' vot 'appened tae zem.

[Maudie]

Just a thought, Head, but do you write your things and then add the accent, or do you just write it with the accent from the start?

[The Shade]

I find a LOT of bankvoles annoying.

[Redwaller]

Most of the voles were despicable. Especially the one in Eulalia! and Martin the Warrior.